Voting blue no matter who seems to have done the US wonders huh?
You can’t have it both ways. Either the progressives not voting had no change on the outcome on of the election thus their strategy has no merit, OR progressives not voting cost democrats the election and the democrat party were at fault for abandoning their base. Oh what’s that? The apathetic vote is not to blame for either scenario? No shit.
And those right wingers have gotten momentum and a lot of what they have asked for. Dems are not as left as we want, but that is where the little progressive politics we have lives. Not voting for it or working to grow is is hurting us.
And also I’m correct, every election is like groundhogs day, like being trapped in a time loop, where leftists go:
“The lesser of two evils is still evil, I’m going to keep my hands clean”.
“Voting doesn’t work, because you can’t fix an inherently flawed system from within the system.”
“Voting is just part of the system of oppression by keeping people complacent from making real changes.”
In my memory this anti-voting/vote boycotting goes back at least to 2000 Bush/Gore.
Now let’s say I’m completely wrong, let’s say I’m crazy and I just made that all up in my head. Let’s say that leftists have always been enthusiastic participators in American democracy, and 2024 was the first ever leftist election boycott.
Now from 2025 to 2028, is the overton window moving left, or right? Will the 2028 election be to the left of 2024, or will 2028 be to the right of 2024?
I’m dead serious willing to bet $500 that 2028 will be to the right of 2024. The overton window is still moving right.
So did my original statement even matter? Either way leftist election boycotts are moving the overton window right, whether it started in 2000, or 2024.
The only question is, how many election boycotts have to fail at doing what leftists want until leftists suddenly become aware they are poking the stick in their own bicycle wheel?
Yes… and you have decided to blame leftists for this instead of the political racketeers who invented and maintains this cyclical pseudo-democratic spectacle itself.
How liberal of you… you, a (supposed) “anti-capitalist.”
You can’t be a liberal and an anti-capitalist, Clyde - you have to decide which you’re going to be.
“Voting doesn’t work, because you can’t fix an inherently flawed system from within the system.”
And they are correct.
“Voting is just part of the system of oppression by keeping people complacent from making real changes.”
And they are still correct.
In my memory this anti-voting/vote boycotting goes back at least to 2000 Bush/Gore.
Nope. It was a thing long before the Russian Revolution, genius - it’s only you liberals that are now finding out how utterly hollow your “liberal democracy” truly is and always have been. Leftists have known that before Marx or Bakunin even went through puberty.
You kinda crashed out and lost the plot, you were claiming that leftists were doing lots of voting up until 2024, but you just confirmed my whole point that leftists did not vote.
Probably be more successful if you stopped being rightists and joined them?
And I think you’ll find that blindly supporting blue no matter who has been done far more often for a couple of decades now. How successful has this been at moving the Overton window left?
The Tea Party, they obliterated the old GOP by not voting them and voting for their people instead. The DNC has kept their party under lock and key to avoid any of that happening.
The Tea Party pushed more conservative candidates in primaries, but in general elections Tea Party voters never sat out in protest - instead, they either supported the GOP candidate or, in a few cases, backed third-party or independent runs, but there were never large-scale abstention.
If you combine Sanders and Warren into one they still would have lost to Biden by a pretty wide margin.
Warren is to the right of Bernie anyway, and Bernie is barely left enough for many leftists; I can’t imagine it was leftists that Warren was splitting away.
If you combine Warren and Sanders into one candidate by the end of Super Tuesday would they have a popular vote lead over Biden in all states who voted up to that point?
Is there a reason Sanders didn’t perform better after Warren dropped out?
Leftists have been doing this strategy for a couple decades now. How successful has this been at moving the Overton window left?
Voting blue no matter who seems to have done the US wonders huh?
You can’t have it both ways. Either the progressives not voting had no change on the outcome on of the election thus their strategy has no merit, OR progressives not voting cost democrats the election and the democrat party were at fault for abandoning their base. Oh what’s that? The apathetic vote is not to blame for either scenario? No shit.
You’re getting confused because it doesn’t have anything to do with the outcome of the last election.
Leftists don’t vote, therefore no one caters to them, therefore the overton window moves right.
No. The left hasn’t.
Yes it has. Voting turnout in the US is dreadful. Who do you think does reliably get out to vote? I’ll give you a hint: it’s right wingers.
And those right wingers have gotten momentum and a lot of what they have asked for. Dems are not as left as we want, but that is where the little progressive politics we have lives. Not voting for it or working to grow is is hurting us.
No, it hasn’t. That is, unless you want to claim that liberals lying themselves into a corner is (somehow) “leftist strategy.”
What? What does that mean in the context of this conversation?
This you?
I could have sworn that was you.
I’m not a liberal, I’m anti-capitalist.
And also I’m correct, every election is like groundhogs day, like being trapped in a time loop, where leftists go:
“The lesser of two evils is still evil, I’m going to keep my hands clean”.
“Voting doesn’t work, because you can’t fix an inherently flawed system from within the system.”
“Voting is just part of the system of oppression by keeping people complacent from making real changes.”
In my memory this anti-voting/vote boycotting goes back at least to 2000 Bush/Gore.
Now let’s say I’m completely wrong, let’s say I’m crazy and I just made that all up in my head. Let’s say that leftists have always been enthusiastic participators in American democracy, and 2024 was the first ever leftist election boycott.
Now from 2025 to 2028, is the overton window moving left, or right? Will the 2028 election be to the left of 2024, or will 2028 be to the right of 2024?
I’m dead serious willing to bet $500 that 2028 will be to the right of 2024. The overton window is still moving right.
So did my original statement even matter? Either way leftist election boycotts are moving the overton window right, whether it started in 2000, or 2024.
The only question is, how many election boycotts have to fail at doing what leftists want until leftists suddenly become aware they are poking the stick in their own bicycle wheel?
Yes… and you have decided to blame leftists for this instead of the political racketeers who invented and maintains this cyclical pseudo-democratic spectacle itself.
How liberal of you… you, a (supposed) “anti-capitalist.”
You can’t be a liberal and an anti-capitalist, Clyde - you have to decide which you’re going to be.
And they are correct.
And they are still correct.
Nope. It was a thing long before the Russian Revolution, genius - it’s only you liberals that are now finding out how utterly hollow your “liberal democracy” truly is and always have been. Leftists have known that before Marx or Bakunin even went through puberty.
Yes. Let’s.
You kinda crashed out and lost the plot, you were claiming that leftists were doing lots of voting up until 2024, but you just confirmed my whole point that leftists did not vote.
I could be wrong, but I get the sense there are a lot of young people on this platform and maybe this is your first experience with election cycles?
I don’t know… how many election cycles has there been since Bush Snr. invaded Panama?
Ok so maybe you’ve been around. How’s the leftist strategy of non participation been working out? Have we moved to closer to our goals?
Probably be more successful if you stopped being rightists and joined them?
And I think you’ll find that blindly supporting blue no matter who has been done far more often for a couple of decades now. How successful has this been at moving the Overton window left?
Let’s compare leftist strategies of never turning out with the evangelical strategy of driving massive turnouts.
Who has had better success shifting their party?
The Tea Party, they obliterated the old GOP by not voting them and voting for their people instead. The DNC has kept their party under lock and key to avoid any of that happening.
You’re misremembering.
The Tea Party pushed more conservative candidates in primaries, but in general elections Tea Party voters never sat out in protest - instead, they either supported the GOP candidate or, in a few cases, backed third-party or independent runs, but there were never large-scale abstention.
Wait, what? No they haven’t. They’ve been turning out in droves in both primaries and general elections.
If leftists are turning out in droves in the primary how are we getting Joe Biden?
Warren split the vote.
If you combine Sanders and Warren into one they still would have lost to Biden by a pretty wide margin.
Warren is to the right of Bernie anyway, and Bernie is barely left enough for many leftists; I can’t imagine it was leftists that Warren was splitting away.
That’s incorrect
Warren and Sanders combined only had 34% of the popular vote in the 2020 primary.
Not on Super Tuesday, the week before Warren dropped out.
If you combine Warren and Sanders into one candidate by the end of Super Tuesday would they have a popular vote lead over Biden in all states who voted up to that point?
Is there a reason Sanders didn’t perform better after Warren dropped out?